= Attendees =

Eric, Greg, Zach, TomG

Held over zoom 

= Agenda =
General
  - Move developer meetings to 2pm Mondays?
  - Prune the agenda list

ChimeraX
  - moving apps up vs moving core down (goal: have python modules on the same level)
  - moving core source code into a src subdirectory like other bundles
  - need not rearrange source to support IDEs, only need editable installs (will require workaround as namespace packages cannot be installed in this mode automatically)
    - editable installs should also let us call ChimeraX with Python for rapid iteration and the C launcher for detailed crash info
  - get_libdir, get_include 
  - write_bundle_classifiers: bundle builder or core?
  - beta releases on Toolshed
  - Should we decouple the core bundle version number from the ChimeraX release version?
  - How best to backport M1 support from native-packaging to 1.4 release branch
  - Review prereq versions after 27 June

Chimera
  - Back up the build machine to a solid state drive

= Discussion =
General
  - Move developer meetings to 2pm Monday and keep 2pm Thursday open for extra discussion
  - Python versioning philosophy: do we track versions?
    - Tom says AlphaFold back on 3.7, they seem uncompelled by updates
    - Zach says we should concentrate on interpreter features -- they're backwards compatible
    - Greg sees no reason to go to 3.10, but is excited by the 3.11 speedup. Zach agrees.
    - Eric points out that forwards compatibility doesn't hold for compiled modules
      - Greg says Bundle Builder has support for the limited API
      - Greg says limited API doesn't save a developer from the need to ensure compiler compatibility
        - PyObject layout could change, etc. 
        - Would be good for us to use limited API if possible to reduce complexity
        - Toolshed bundles would work for multiple versions
    - Tom notes we have many dependencies that may not support 3.11 right off the bat
    - Python 3.9 EOL is October 2025 (3.7 is in June 2023)

ChimeraX
  - Greg suggest making bundle builder into a build backend 
  - toml support is experimental, shouldn't announce to external developers quite yet 
  - Greg doesn't want hybrid builds in develop. Could do it in a branch for testing, but don't allow developers to opt in until it's ready. 
    - Afraid of early adopters shooting themselves in the foot
  - setuptools upgrade a little more complex than {{{ from setuptools import distutils }}}
  - More sensible move core down next to the rest of the bundles
    - Have core participate in the dependency graph that we generate with the python script

  - PR order:
    - Move main to {{{core/__main__.py}}}
    - Don't build apps first
    - (app/build) python3 -m chimerax.core as appropriate 
    - Move core down 
    - Put core code in core/src
    - Make bundle builder a build backend
    - Won't do hybrid builds until ready for primetime

  - Removed from agenda:
    - What happens to ChimeraX Tasks at app quit (let's make a ticket)
      - Relevant to task manager
    - Rename ChimeraX.exe on Windows? (let's make a ticket)
    - Should we go to Python 3.10 in 1.5?
      - Zach put this on the agenda, says PyOpenGL-Accelerate has not been updated
      - The Python speed update is 3.11
      - Could move to Qt OpenGL API
      - Tentatively 3.11 in 1.6 

Chimera
  - Not going to touch Chimera as much as possible. 
  - Could set up VMWare machine and use that to build ChimeraX on Windows 7
    - Zach suggests QEMU
  - If we're going to move to Windows 10 should do it before it's not available anymore
  - Tom says we should just set up another Windows 7 machine if the current one dies
  - Cygwin near to releasing last Windows 7 version
  - Should do a disk level backup of Windows 7 machine
 
  - Removed from agenda:
    - Switch Chimera daily builds from Windows 7 to Windows 10 (let's make a ticket)

  - Implications of sunsetting Chimera
    - GROMACS support would probably break first
    - Tk toolkit needs another update
    - macOS support dicey

Infrastructure
 - Trac much more stable than it used to be after BeeGFS upgrades
 - Eric notes 1 problem in the last 3 months
 - Still a good idea to upgrade the database but no longer life or death 

 - Removed from agenda:
   - Upgrade Trac to mysql for better reliability. (let's make a ticket)

= TODO =
  - Present github continuous integration tutorial.  Zach
  - Remove pkg-config prereq if it is not being used for builds. Tom